124 replies to this topic

[sdwright.vic]

Actually when they bought Safeway they sold all property holdings under Safeway to Empire. This right hand seems to talk to is left alot

[Bingo]

The store will likely have wide isles and be scooter friendly for all the old farts that are moving downtown. 

[jonny]

Big companies don't operate the way that you might think. Just because one division has an asset doesn't mean that other divisions get open access. More often than not the left hand has no idea what the right hand is even up to.

 

OK...

 

Who was talking about open access?

 

I'm sure the Empire Board of Directors has no discussions about how to utilize its real estate assets that coincide with conversations about its largest line of business (grocery). Riiiiiight.

 

Empire is a consolidated legal entity...I am sure they are always looking at ways to deploy its assets and generate a ROI. Right now, the Capitol 6 property isn't generating much of a return.

[concorde]

I can speak to the big company philosophy.

 

Years ago I bought a large commercial building owned by the commercial real estate division of a large retail operation.  Anyway I bought the building and part of the deal was they sign a major long term lease as the anchor tenant (they are still there after 30 years).  They have allowed me to pay for the building, make large capital gains on the property and they are still there giving me a big fat monthly cheque which is mine now free and clear.

 

Now wouldn't it have been smart for them to keep the real estate in the company and pay themselves each month.  Doesn't make sense to me, but I'm not complaining

[jonny]

But they got a big pile of cash back in the day which they may have needed at the time for other ventures.

 

Sounds like it worked great in your favor though Concorde!

[Mike K.]

Not unlike the sweet deal the CRD gave to Wilson's Foods in Esquimalt. $17 million for their property, which they have now leased from the CRD. Meanwhile as History Buff hypothesized they have likely bought out a competitor with that money.

[spanky123]

But they got a big pile of cash back in the day which they may have needed at the time for other ventures.

 

Sounds like it worked great in your favor though Concorde!

They could have mortgaged the building, taken the cash and still had ownership.

[concorde]

But they got a big pile of cash back in the day which they may have needed at the time for other ventures.

 

Sounds like it worked great in your favor though Concorde!

I am not sure how much of that big pile of cash they would have used to purchase Canada Safeway, I doubt they would get 100% financing in this market

 

Its strange how some of the big corporations work.  Don't always assume they work with logic

 

Either way for the Capital 6 I can't see anyone trying to convert that existing building into a grocery store.  Hmmm, I wonder if I can buy it, tear it down, build to suit and lease it back to them <insert evil laugh here>

[sdwright.vic]

They do hand themselves a huge huge check... Sobeys, Safeway, Thrifty's, et al, all hand their patent company a big check each month for rent, this decreasing their gains because of having to pay this rent. Empire male money having all the companies or owns owe it money. I am sure Safeway properties went for a reduced price when Empire took them

[spanky123]

They do hand themselves a huge huge check... Sobeys, Safeway, Thrifty's, et al, all hand their patent company a big check each month for rent, this decreasing their gains because of having to pay this rent. Empire male money having all the companies or owns owe it money. I am sure Safeway properties went for a reduced price when Empire took them

CRA doesn't allow that. Asset transfers between related parties are done at fair market value.

[sdwright.vic]

Okay, but still no bidding war and stilll getting a check each month, which allows the secondary business to have less profit and more operating cost

[jonny]

I am not sure how much of that big pile of cash they would have used to purchase Canada Safeway, I doubt they would get 100% financing in this market.

 

By financing you mean bank financing?

 

They're a public company, so they could have issued more shares or even made a bond issue. I don't know what they did though.

 

I agree, I can't see this building being converted into anything, really. It was built as a movie theater, which seem to have very specific building designs that would be hard to work with. I doubt a major company like Sobeys/Thriftys would want a major new store to be constrained with having a sub par retail space.

[jonny]

Okay, but still no bidding war and stilll getting a check each month, which allows the secondary business to have less profit and more operating cost

 

This type of accounting can be quite complex, but rest assured there are accounting standards. A lot of those are around fair market value, like Spanky mentioned. I doubt Empire would be doing things that are too goofy, given they are a large, Canadian, publicly traded company.

[sdwright.vic]

Don't see them as to difficult when they keep each other at am arms reach of each other.

Jace Holdings it's still a fully functioning subsidiary of Thrifty Foods holding the Warehouses.

Edited by sdwright.vic, 10 July 2014 - 08:24 AM.

[concorde]

By financing you mean bank financing?

 

They're a public company, so they could have issued more shares or even made a bond issue. I don't know what they did though.

 

I agree, I can't see this building being converted into anything, really. It was built as a movie theater, which seem to have very specific building designs that would be hard to work with. I doubt a major company like Sobeys/Thriftys would want a major new store to be constrained with having a sub par retail space.

yes, I mean bank financing and yes they could have issued more shares or a bond issue.  They also could have done a partial stock swap.  I really don't remember the specific details.  I don't even know if Safeway owns all the stores they are in, I suspect a lot of them are not

[jonny]

yes, I mean bank financing and yes they could have issued more shares or a bond issue.  They also could have done a partial stock swap.  I really don't remember the specific details.  I don't even know if Safeway owns all the stores they are in, I suspect a lot of them are not

 

Yeah, there are probably a lot of leases as the stores seem to be located in a lot of shopping malls.

[HB]

I was in a Sobeys that takes up part of Maple Leaf Gardens in Toronto

[bluefox]

I was in a Sobeys that takes up part of Maple Leaf Gardens in Toronto

 

That is a Loblaws store. (And a damn nice one at that.)

[HB]

Ok my mistake but ues it is awesome

[sdwright.vic]

Couldn't find the actual Theatre thread, but something is going on inside. Saw a drafting table with plans on it there today.