664 replies to this topic

[jonny]

Thank you Marko.

 

Like I said earlier

 

...I'd be surprised if the banks and auditors were so easily duped.

[VicBooster]

As a REALTOR®, with a three week course behind me, it's a 2 minute procedure for me to verify the facts.  Look up BC Assessments and see how many condos have changed hands and for what amount.  72 out of 96 have sold.  Next, search the land title records (public information) for the Mondrian strata plan.  Once again, 96 results with 96 names, 24 registered to Alpha Developments (the unsold units).  One of the developers has one condo registered in his name. 

 

If there are 96 units and 96 names how can 24 of them also be registered to Alpha?

 

Presales started almost four years ago. Marko can you look at transactions over this period to see if titles switched hands.

[MarkoJ]

If there are 96 units and 96 names how can 24 of them also be registered to Alpha?

 

Presales started almost four years ago. Marko can you look at transactions over this period to see if titles switched hands.

 

24 of the 96 names are "Alpha Developments," meaning the developer has 24 unsold units still in their name.

 

The title does not exchange hands during pre-sales.  The property only has a title on completion.

[Mike K.]

Conceivably could a developer "purchase" x number of presales and then make them available by not closing come completion or putting them up for sale immediately after completion? We know for a fact the developers own one unit, why couldn't they have purchased a dozen others under corporate entities or through other family members? I'm not understanding how a developer buying his units is against the rules. And surely if financing is secured through a private lender and not one of the big banks there is more opportunity for an easier acceptance process, no?

I mean what happens when a buyer defaults? They lose their deposit and the unit goes back up for sale, right? Meanwhile financing has been secured.

See the thing is this sort of thing is a fairly common practice. Denying it happens or not believing it happens doesn't change things. I'd like to think concorde knows the ins and outs of this business and he acknowledges the developer picked up units.

[MarkoJ]

Conceivably could a developer "purchase" x number of presales and then make them available by not closing come completion or putting them up for sale immediately after completion? We know for a fact the developers own one unit, why couldn't they have purchased a dozen others under corporate entities or through other family members? I'm not understanding how a developer buying his units is against the rules. And surely if financing is secured through a private lender and not one of the big banks there is more opportunity for an easier acceptance process, no?

I mean what happens when a buyer defaults? They lose their deposit and the unit goes back up for sale, right? Meanwhile financing has been secured.

See the thing is this sort of thing is a fairly common practice. Denying it happens or not believing it happens doesn't change things. I'd like to think concorde knows the ins and outs of this business and he acknowledges the developer picked up units.

 

I am not saying it doesn't happen.  It happens in a lot of developments. For example, at 200 Douglas the developer purchased a penthouse.  I just don't believe that buying units is happening to manipulate construction financing.  To me it shows that the developer is throwing more of his or her own money at the project.  Also, my understanding is that pre-sale contracts are reviewed by lenders; therefore, if they are seeing a lot of limited companies buying, low deposit figures, or similar, they will have reason for concern and may not issue construction financing.  

 

I doubt they lend out $10 to $50 million for a project without due diligence, Bear Mountain aside

[Baro]

As long as they don't screw up the ground level (like they usually do) I honestly don't care how tall it is.  A nice 4 story building with zero setbacks, great architecture, and an awesome street-wall effect would be lovely.  Plop a 15 story tower on top of that? Sure, I won't notice, most people won't notice, it's only the first few floors that matter.  Everything else is just how it looks in a skyline photo.  Obviously a nice tower is better than a poor one, but I wish we'd stop agonizing over height and density numbers and put that effort into those incredibly precious few meters where the sidewalk meets the building.

 

The Manhattan already kills the street there and any chance of a street-wall with its big suburban driveway and drop-off zone, but the rest of the side of that street actually does pretty well.  The electronics store is just a disposable little 1 story, but it's right against the street and retail so good work.  That recently renovated old office building by the 7-11 is ok too.  Kinda stark but at least there's no setback.  7-11 is a bit of a disaster zone but what can you do about that.

 

As long as the new project bridges the street wall between the existing clothing store and the electronics store I'll be happy.   It's a wide enough lot that I think they can pull of the parkade entrance but still have some good street interaction.  Sometimes when a lot is too narrow all you have room for is an ugly parkade ramp and a lobby door.

 

This intersection sees a lot of pedestrian activity and I think it's a good place for more retail.  So many projects over-build retail that isn't needed (mondrian's is a disaster) but I think retail would do well here.  Yates is easy to cross with the mid-block crosswalk and signalled crosswalks at vancouver.  If it wasn't for Regent's park that intersection could have grown into quite a nice urban neighbourhood, the cook st. village of... of what ever we call this sub-neighbourhood.  London-Green?   Harris Drugs?

 

Anyways, this is my neighbourhood, I walk this street nearly every day, so I hope we get something nice from the sidewalk.

[Mike K.]

As long as they don't screw up the ground level (like they usually do) I honestly don't care how tall it is.  A nice 4 story building with zero setbacks, great architecture, and an awesome street-wall effect would be lovely.  Plop a 15 story tower on top of that? Sure, I won't notice, most people won't notice, it's only the first few floors that matter.  Everything else is just how it looks in a skyline photo.  Obviously a nice tower is better than a poor one, but I wish we'd stop agonizing over height and density numbers and put that effort into those incredibly precious few meters where the sidewalk meets the building.

 

 

Street frontage is just one aspect of development. Wouldn't you rather see 150 units as opposed to 50? If we are to build a thriving, self-sustaining urban downtown we won't do it with low density and limited units. Put the four storey stuff in Fairfield and James Bay, and put the big stuff in downtown. It's the common sense thing to do IMO.

[concorde]

what typically happens during lean times is that the developer sells units to the major subcontractors and general contractor to get the presales up.  Banks aren't stupid so I can't just go in and personally buy up 10% of the units myself.  Anyone want to guess why Elsie Farmer (widow of Farmer Construction founder George Farmer) lived at Shoal Point when she was alive

 

buying of units by developers/contractors typically happens only in lean times, but not always.  Major contractors at Oak Bay Beach had to all loan money to the development to get it running

 

I admit I don't have all the facts on Mondrian, most of the information I get is from friends, developers over lunches, coffee, etc.  Yes profits are what I stated but as I said when you have 25% of units unsold and all of the commercial space vacant a year after occupancy, that is not a success in my opinion.  Maybe it is in yours Marko, but you are entitled to your opinion

 

Mike, I can't state for absolute certain that Alpha bought units.  For all I know it was family members or whatever or maybe not at all.  You have to remember some of the info gets passed along to me, and I will admit some of the facts get a little twisted along the way.

 

Anyway, anything is better that what is there now.  Its only a block away you have major car lots

[ryleyb]

I just got a notice of a community meeting for this (I think?  Is it 960-962 Yates).  The only things I saw was that it's listed as 17 stories and the architect was de Hoog.

Edited by ryleyb, 08 August 2014 - 07:28 AM.

[Mike K.]

Thanks for the update!

[Mixed365]

Any idea where Phillip Nyren will be going? On the DTZ website all it says is:

"DTZ is working on behalf of Philip Nyren Menswear to find a new location for their retail store"

[Mixed365]

I just got a notice of a community meeting for this (I think?  Is it 960-962 Yates).  The only things I saw was that it's listed as 17 stories and the architect was de Hoog.

Do you have any more information on the community meeting ryleyb? I would love to attend. 

[ryleyb]

Do you have any more information on the community meeting ryleyb? I would love to attend. 

 

It's Thursday (August 14th) at 5pm, 3rd floor of 915 Fort Street "Victoria Executive Centre".

[jonny]

17 floors? Sounds awesome! Yates is turning into quite the happening street.

[Mike K.]

Just you wait, it'll be knocked DOWN by several floors to ensure "variability" in heights. Because we couldn't possibly build slightly higher than an adjacent building, only shorter.

If we couldn't get a 17-storey tower approved next to View Towers what's the likelihood that this thing breaks 15 floors, if that?

[Nparker]

17 floors? Sounds awesome...

From your text to Council's ears. Let's hope this doesn't get chopped down to half the proposed size.

[jonny]

If we couldn't get a 17-storey tower approved next to View Towers what's the likelihood that this thing breaks 15 floors, if that?

 

I don't know, but I sense that times have changed. City Hall does seem more receptive to development downtown than in year's past.

 

For some real height variability this thing should be 27 floors.

[Nparker]

....The only things I saw was that it's listed as 17 stories and the architect was de Hoog.

I checked out the de Hoog website last night, but couldn't find even a hint of this project. I'd love to see even a massing model of what is proposed.

[D.L.]

Here's the design, a first draft. The architect, Peter de Hoog, was mulling over changes to some aspects when I spoke with him, but overall this is the idea. The city requires a street wall right at the sidewalk and had suggested five floors, this design does three. The tower fills the allowed density of the site, 5.1 FSR. The architect and developer opted to build to the allowed height of 50 m rather than a shorter and wider building. There are two retail spaces on the right side of the street front and the garage entrance on the left side.

 

Architect: de Hoog & Kierulf Architects

Developer: Alpha Project Developments

 

 

 

[Mike K.]

Thanks for the info.

Do we know if it's a condo or a rental?