678 replies to this topic

[Stephen James]

Most people don't realize it but nearly 1/3rd of Langford's revenue came from developers in 2021 (we don't get the 2022 statements until June). That wasn't sustainable with interest rates shooting up and development slowing. That is likely the primary reason why even the old council was forecasting big property tax increases in upcoming years.

 

2021 Final April 19 2022 Audited Financial Statements with JDF.xlsx (langford.ca)  

huh? that's a convenient guess about the future.

 

What we know is true is that Langford's new gov has decided it's more important to pad the slush funds than help the community out, and that has a bad smell.

[Stephen James]

Danma, thank you for bringing some clarity to this issue. I concur with everything you say. And I read somewhere that we are still below average for the region. Perhaps we could get some of the Our Langford Stew Crew to read this forum, and start letting this M+C do their work

 

"below average for the region"; "it's bad everywhere"

 

These are the playbook, of course... we're well familiar with this gas-lighting in Victoria. In the Victoria experience, it's an awkward smokescreen for bad management, poor decisions, and some silly marxist moves. 

 

I'm sure that's not happening in Langford now, though.

[Victoria Watcher]

I suppose there are some critical things that a municipality does, that are going to be subject to inflation.

 

But most of the cost of running a municipality is wages, and they are only increasing like the collective agreement dictates.

 

For other items, see where you can do with less, or without.  Put in a hiring freeze for now, you lose a percentage every year to retirement or other loss anyway, see if you can get by replacing less.  Look at replacing some with technology, like lots of companies do.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 09 May 2023 - 09:18 AM.

[Mike K.]

On my last property tax bill, General Municipal Tax and General Municipal Debt was 35% of my total taxes. CRD is 15%. The rest is all individual items like JDF, GVPL, school, police, hospital, transit, etc.

 

Yes, and then you have to add police and whatever else lands under the municipal budget. They collectively factor into the 49%, and are subject to municipal tax increases.

[Mike K.]

But most of the cost of running a municipality is wages, and they are only increasing like the collective agreement dictates.

 

That's got to be one of the reasons why Langford relied on private contractors, not in-house crews for sanitation, public works, etc.

[Danma]

Yes, and then you have to add police and whatever else lands under the municipal budget. They collectively factor into the 49%, and are subject to municipal tax increases.

 

Ah, indeed, I missed that detail and stand corrected.

 

 

That's got to be one of the reasons why Langford relied on private contractors, not in-house crews for sanitation, public works, etc.

Stew always liked contracting out services to third parties – especially if he or family owned them! I would think there's some cost savings there, but contractor costs are rising too so it'll catch up with them sooner or later.

[Danma]

But most of the cost of running a municipality is wages, and they are only increasing like the collective agreement dictates.

 

Indeed, the lion's share of the increased costs are higher head counts for fire, police and staff. 

[Victoria Watcher]

Alpine Disposal, even corrected for customer base size and collection overhead, collected garbage at about 60% of the cost of municipal services.

That’s smart.

[Mike K.]

Yes, we currently pay 50% of the sanitation cost of the CoV by using Alpine. That’s another hidden tax in the CoV.

[Stephen James]

Ah, indeed, I missed that detail and stand corrected.

 

 

Stew always liked contracting out services to third parties – especially if he or family owned them! I would think there's some cost savings there, but contractor costs are rising too so it'll catch up with them sooner or later.

There is literally no reason for that to catch up, and every reason to continue the process on behalf of the taxpayer.

ESPECIALLY since Helps single handedly destroyed the muni bargaining unit. (she's been paid back for that several times over... welcome.)

 

Bidding and contracting is transparency, disclosure, AND accountability.

 

You can already see the awkward campaigning to bring all that into the opaque, expensive, union shop asap and I'm sure that's part of the ideological bs. Hopefully Langford citizens will catch this before it happens, because they will pay and pay if it doesnt.

[Stephen James]

Yes, we currently pay 50% of the sanitation cost of the CoV by using Alpine. That’s another hidden tax in the CoV.

Yes Mike and Helps got her $80,000 payback recently.

 

Good for the unions, good for Helps... and I guess 2 outa 3 ain't bad. (poor us.)

[Stephen James]

I'll put a loony down now... for any takers:

 

Langford will pad its unions asap and they'll do it several ways, including bringing as much in house as possible. Nothing about that will be good for taxpayers, but it will be good for career ideologues.

 

(I believe I can see the apologists already laying track for this terrible move in social and print media.)

Edited by Stephen James, 10 May 2023 - 09:36 AM.

[Mike K.]

Yes, we can expect that to take place, or an effort to do so, at least.

[spanky123]

Langford will pad its unions asap and they'll do it several ways, including bringing as much in house as possible. 

 

I don't know. I would think that a guy who runs his own landscaping business wouldn't be all that pro union!

Edited by spanky123, 10 May 2023 - 10:09 AM.

[Danma]

There is literally no reason for that to catch up, and every reason to continue the process on behalf of the taxpayer.

 

You misunderstand – I'm not arguing the value of going with third party contractors, I was simply stating that third party contractors have costs and are subject to inflation as well, and those costs will eventually get passed onto their customers. 

Edited by Danma, 10 May 2023 - 10:56 AM.

[Danma]

I don't know. I would think that a guy who runs his own landscaping business wouldn't be all that pro union!

 

Yeah, I think it remains to be seen.

 

Personally, given the amount of attention Langford residents are giving to council's decisions now, I don't think we're actually going to see much in the way of underhanded trickery, regardless of what conspiracy theorists in the room think.

(I'll be honest, the amount of baseless conjecture in here is approaching "crazy man in basement with strings tied to a cork board covered with photos" levels...)

[Mike K.]

You misunderstand – I'm not arguing the value of going with third party contractors, I was simply stating that third party contractors have costs and are subject to inflation as well, and those costs will eventually get passed onto their customers. 

 

Yes, but when you hire a third party contractor, you only pay the contractor for the work they do, and then your obligation is over. You don't have to pay them for the other 290 days of the year they're not doing work for you, nor do you have to supply them with annual benefits, machinery and tools, their vehicles, management, supervisors, their office space, etc.

[Danma]

Yes, but when you hire a third party contractor, you only pay the contractor for the work they do, and then your obligation is over. You don't have to pay them for the other 290 days of the year they're not doing work for you, nor do you have to supply them with annual benefits, machinery and tools, their vehicles, management, supervisors, their office space, etc.

 

All true – but none of that really affects my statement that if a contractor's internal costs go up, they'll raise their rates to their customers including the City of Langford.

 

Edit: To clarify, my original point was that hiring contractors doesn't protect you from rising costs and inflation. I do agree that contractors provide a valuable service in the ways you describe in general.

Edited by Danma, 11 May 2023 - 09:26 AM.

[Mike K.]

Yes, that will increase for sure. But that higher cost is a small fraction of what it would cost to have the same manpower working full time for the muni.

[Stephen James]

You misunderstand – I'm not arguing the value of going with third party contractors, I was simply stating that third party contractors have costs and are subject to inflation as well, and those costs will eventually get passed onto their customers. 

I think I did.

 

By catch up i was thinking "catch up to the cost of bringing all in-house, into a union shop". It would obviously never catch up to this because costs on the in-house side would increase (passively) in the same way.