746 replies to this topic

[aastra]

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Daily Colonist
June 6, 1902

Edison believes that he has solved the difficulty of long-distance electric automobiling, a battery which he has just finished being capable of a 100-mile run without recharging. The storage of electricity is a field that will repay exploration by inventors. Lord Kelvin, in his recent address in New York, spoke hopefully of overcoming the difficulties of electrical transmission, but he had nothing to say concerning the storage of the elusive fluid.

[Mike K.]

Edison’s tech was pushed into the dustbin of history, so that science could push a better solution, which became the petroleum industry. It was revolutionary, what petroleum accomplished, but we should also consider it highly questionable that electric cars became virtually obsolete because of dinosaur juice. Were market forces at work, or were they political forces?

Obama’s job was to make the alternatives look amazing but deep down we all knew they’re ridiculous and unobtainable (applause). Case in point, how’s that water/sun car coming along, btw? It’s been 12 years since Obama’s announcement. Musk conceived of, and has delivered millions of cars since, and political policy is now being drafted because of him.

$5 says Obama becomes the Al Gore of EVs.

[Victoria Watcher]

Edison’s tech was pushed into the dustbin of history, so that science could push a better solution, which became the petroleum industry. It was revolutionary, what petroleum accomplished, but we should also consider it highly questionable that electric cars became virtually obsolete because of dinosaur juice. Were market forces at work, or were they political forces?

Obama’s job was to make the alternatives look amazing but deep down we all knew they’re ridiculous and unobtainable (applause). Case in point, how’s that water/sun car coming along, btw? It’s been 12 years since Obama’s announcement. Musk conceived of, and has delivered millions of cars since, and political policy is now being drafted because of him.

Well, we became quite good at the internal combustion engine. But the general process is still the same as it was in 1912.

We only recently achieved gains in battery tech. Specifically energy density.

[Mike K.]

Could we not have become quite good with EVs, too, had they not been pushed aside for ICE motors?

The oil barons had oil to sell. And they had a lot of influence on politics at that time.

[Victoria Watcher]

Could we not have become quite good with EVs, too, had they not been pushed aside for ICE motors?

 

I don't think we had the nano-technology that is required to make today's high density batteries.

 

And most of the technology to make the motors etc. efficient.   That requires sophisticated electronics and computer chips.  Back then we did not even have transistors (the precursor to computer chips, not developed until the 50's).   It would have been very tough to make cars with vacuum tubes that were reliable in that type of environment.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 01 May 2023 - 07:24 AM.

[Victoria Watcher]

The oil barons had oil to sell. And they had a lot of influence on politics at that time.

 

And it was a very useful fuel.   Before then we were killing whales for lighting fluid.

 

I don't think it was just about American "oil barons".  Petroleum is used all over the world, even in countries that do not allow capitalism (Venezuela, Sudan).

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 01 May 2023 - 07:28 AM.

[Mike K.]

Oh it wasn’t quite that cut and dry. If you peer into the history of the energy industry you’ll learn about plenty of shenanigans.

It was all politics then, as it is now.

[aastra]

 

they had a lot of influence on politics at that time.

 

Back in the day there were all kinds of forces that had influence on politics.

 

But thankfully we corrected that issue and now all is good. Let's face it, our parents and grandparents just weren't very sophisticated about such matters. They were easily deceived and taken advantage of.

[lanforod]

Best laugh I've had all week.

[amor de cosmos]

i should really get into the heat pump business in BC right now. not only will i make a load of money, people will revere me as a mystic visionary of capitalism.   

[Mike K.]

People will be out for your head.

Have you ever heard a heat pump that’s a few years old and not maintained? It’s a nightmare for the next door neighbour, because 9/10 the homeowner installs it where it’s least undesirable for them, most undesirable for their neighbour. And even when installed correctly, they can emit a hum that can become invasive. I’d have a logo-less van if I were installing those things.

Natural gas is superior in every way, but we know that’s not something to brag about on Twitter.

[Victoria Watcher]

Natural gas is superior in every way, but we know that’s not something to brag about on Twitter.

 

 

 

New York on cusp of being first state in nation to ban natural gas under new budget — and residents are furious

 

https://nypost.com/2...so-hot-an-idea/

 

 

 

 

I'm not so sure natural gas is superior in every way.  But heat pumps could sure be way better.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 02 May 2023 - 06:03 AM.

[Mike K.]

Back in the day there were all kinds of forces that had influence on politics.

Except certain electricity technologies. Those forces didn’t have enough influence on politics.

[Mike K.]

People are going nuts over them, but don’t consider the implications of where they install them. Apparently it’s a big deal in Saanich which has no regulations on location relative to other properties.

[spanky123]

New York on cusp of being first state in nation to ban natural gas under new budget — and residents are furious

 

https://nypost.com/2...so-hot-an-idea/

 

I'm not so sure natural gas is superior in every way.  But heat pumps could sure be way better.

 

Heat pumps can be useful in moderate climates but most aren't going to exclusively heat your house when it is -10 outside as efficiency drops off sharply. Alternative then is baseboard electric heating which is the least efficient of all heating types.

[spanky123]

i should really get into the heat pump business in BC right now. not only will i make a load of money, people will revere me as a mystic visionary of capitalism. 

 

Heat pumps have been around for decades. There is a reason why they are popular but not the most practical solution for everyone.

Edited by spanky123, 02 May 2023 - 08:45 AM.

[Victoria Watcher]

Alternative then is baseboard electric heating which is the least efficient of all heating types.

 

 

Electric baseboard heating is as efficient as any other type of resistive electric heating.  You can also have a heat pump and inject warm air into the output ducts with resistive heating, with an electric furnace. 

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 02 May 2023 - 08:52 AM.

[spanky123]

Electric baseboard heating is as efficient as any other type of resistive electric heating.  You can also have a heat pump and inject warm air into the output ducts with resistive heating. 

 

Ok let me rephrase, resistive heating is the least efficient of all heating types!

 

You are right, lots of people don't even realize that when it gets cold the resistive element in their heat pump kicks in.

Edited by spanky123, 02 May 2023 - 08:53 AM.

[Victoria Watcher]

Electric resistive heating is 100% efficient. In that it turns that electricity into heat. 100% of it.

Now, the way that electricity was produced back at the power plant, and losses bringing it to you makes it less efficient.

And the cost per unit of heat with electric resistive heating might be higher than burning gas in a home furnace.

One of the problems with any type of sophisticated home heating system is sizing it right. You can make errors with both over sizing and under sizing your unit. At least with baseboard heaters, that’s not really a problem, if you have one in every room.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 02 May 2023 - 09:09 AM.

[Stephen James]

i should really get into the heat pump business in BC right now. not only will i make a load of money, people will revere me as a mystic visionary of capitalism. 

second-most mystic of capitalism, right after security fence manu-installers.