63 replies to this topic

[tjv]

^I understand that, but will your rules be constitutional?  Not saying they won't be, but they have to be able to pass the test if its taken to court

[Nparker]

Oh, but mine comes with LOTS of extra rules. ..

Many will choose to stay on the street then. No one likes to admit this, but not living by society's rules - whether by choice or by circumstance - is a reason why many are homeless.

[Sparky]

Ok, that's basically what they get now except they have a full bathroom and the rooms are a little bigger. I have drawings for Mt Edwards and Tally Ho, just no idea how to post them

Take a picture with your phone.

[VicHockeyFan]

^I understand that, but will your rules be constitutional?  Not saying they won't be, but they have to be able to pass the test if its taken to court

 

It's not a housing complex, it's an invitational night-by-night sleeping arrangement, like a hotel.

 

Many may reject this shelter, and choose to sleep outdoors.  That's fine, but not in parks, when we have spaces available here.

 

This meets all the needs like Mt. Edwards or 844, but with much more efficiency, and of course more rules.  And it's much better than mats in a church hall.

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 19 November 2017 - 10:15 AM.

[spanky123]

Oh, but mine comes with LOTS of extra rules.  For example, zero guests in the building or your room.  It's not a social centre, it's a place to get you out of the cold weather.  It's a free roof over your head, plus just a bit more.  It's not your permanent home, either.  

 

My rules will be coming soon.

 

Great initiative but won't fly. Ask anyone on the board or management team at any one of the poverty service providers and they will tell you the same thing. The goal is not to just house the homeless, the goal is to get them homes. The same thing you and I have wherever these folks want to live. Nothing short of that is acceptable and solutions such as what you propose actually work against that goal as it takes the focus off of people living on the streets.

[VicHockeyFan]

The ones that show they can take care of these sleeping units will be first on the list for available better housing.  This is your path in.

 

But this is also for single-employables.  Single-employables are not eligible for any other completely free housing.

 

The biggest advantage of what I'm building here is that they are cheap.    And they are not converted hotel (Super 8, Tally Ho) or senior assisted-living units (Mt. Edwards), that on the whole are the completely wrong -and expensive - way to go.

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 19 November 2017 - 10:21 AM.

[spanky123]

It's not a housing complex, it's an invitational night-by-night sleeping arrangement, like a hotel.

 

Many may reject this shelter, and choose to sleep outdoors.  That's fine, but not in parks, when we have spaces available here.

 

This meets all the needs like Mt. Edwards or 844, but with much more efficiency, and of course more rules.  And it's much better than mats in a church hall.

 

Where would you build this?

[johnk]

Simple. Inexpensive.
These words are not in the bureaucrat-politician-academic vocabulary.

[VicHockeyFan]

Where would you build this?

 

Ideally, we'd build it in an aging school gym.  And then build the school a new gym.  Vic High, Esq, High?  The existing Crystal Pool building?  The CRD warehouse in Esqiuimalt?  The warehouse under 3025 Douglas St.?

[VicHockeyFan]

Rules:

 

1.  You can stay as long as you want, if you abide by the rules.  But after 3 months and 6 months there are other requirements to extend your stay (see #8).

 

2.  No guests in the room, or in the building.  It's not a social centre, it's your warm, safe, secure home base to help you sort your life.

 

3.  Lights on at 7am, off (dimmed) at 10pm.  After 10pm, radio/TV only with headphones.  No noise from units.

 

4.  No cooking, no food storage beyond snacks in the unit.  (Free) meals are available elsewhere in town.

 

5.  No entry 10pm to 7am, unless you have a legitimate work note.  Leave at any time ie. at 5am for work. 

 

6.  24 hours notice of room check.  Rooms expected to be kept clean, tidy, sanitary.

 

7.  No "barrier" if you consume alcohol or drugs in your own room, are not disruptive to other tenants, or intoxicated in the (very limited) common areas.  And as above, you keep the room clean.

 

8.  After 3 months, you must attend counselling/work preparation sessions, and after 6 months you must enlist in a volunteer team with required hours per week.  These hours increase with each 6-month extension of your stay.  These can be reset if you are away from the centre for a 3-month period.  ie. at that time you will be admitted as a new intake without these obligations for 3 months.   

 

MORE TO COME...

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 19 November 2017 - 12:41 PM.

[Love the rock]

VHF what do you want to bet that if you took your rough idea to Chrissy campers
most would have negative comments about your free housing idea .

[Bingo]

 

Now, this is a bit of a start on the overall room floor plan.  It's not yet to scale, but gives you an idea.

 

You can see the individual units with their own door.  They are about 8-10' deep from the doorway to the back wall, and I'm not sure yet how wide.

 

All the solid walls here are cinder-block.

 

With all the clutter they have the door would need to open outwards, and also in case of fire.

I don't think they would be allowed to have a locked door, as the paramedics need access.

Where is the laundry room? 

[VicHockeyFan]

With all the clutter they have the door would need to open outwards, and also in case of fire.

I don't think they would be allowed to have a locked door, as the paramedics need access.

Where is the laundry room? 

 

There is coin-op laundry onsite, it's not free.  And free showers.

 

They are allowed minimal clutter.  That will be in the extended rules.

 

Paramedics can have access like they would have in a hotel room, or like they have in Cool Aid housing now..  The staffers have access to let them in if needed.      

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 19 November 2017 - 01:28 PM.

[VicHockeyFan]

This housing must by necessity be very low frills.  If we keep providng homes with complete bathrooms, that allows visitors, and has on-site food service, why would we ever expect to be able to stop building those?  Who would want to leave Super 8 or Tally Ho?

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 19 November 2017 - 02:35 PM.

[VicHockeyFan]

We can afford to build these very basic units, we can not afford to pay for hotel conversions, we'll never have enough money.

 

The province paid $178,846 per suite for the Tally Ho.  $9.3M for 52 units.  And $127,450 per unit for the Super 8.

 

My units cost less than $10,000 each, if we have a building first.  

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 20 November 2017 - 07:44 AM.

[Wayne]

We can afford to build these very basic units, we can not afford to pay for hotel conversions, we'll never have enough money.
 
The province paid $178,846 per suite for the Tally Ho.  $9.3M for 52 units.  And $127,450 per unit for the Super 8.
 
My units cost less than $10,000 each, if we have a building first.

Look like a very viable plan. Hopefully it can get some attention. It will take much effort for this to ever get traction, but the current systems (too many systems) are not working with its revolving door enablers.

[VicHockeyFan]

When you pay $178,000 (plus staff fees, maintenance, insurance, utilities etc.) to house one person, and the only "income" you have from that person is you withholding $375/mo. from their welfare cheque, you can see you have a cash-flow problem.

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 20 November 2017 - 08:09 AM.

[spanky123]

When you pay $178,000 (plus staff fees, maintenance, insurance, utilities etc.) to house one person, and the only "income" you have from that person is you withholding $375/mo. from their welfare cheque, you can see you have a cash-flow problem.

 

As you have said before, and as the PBO agrees, there are no outcomes tied to funding (other than to ensure that campaign backers and pimps get to line their pockets) so receiving $375 a month for a unit that costs $800 a month to carry isn't a problem at all.

 

http://nationalpost....-tells-liberals

[lanforod]

One problem I see is that you're stuck with buildings in the downtown area, as there isn't food service outside of there.

[VicHockeyFan]

One problem I see is that you're stuck with buildings in the downtown area, as there isn't food service outside of there.

 

We're gonna teach these folks how to use the bus!  Look, I'm sorry that these units do not come with breakfast in bed.  There is a reason why they don't.  It's to make it just a bit less comfortable than say, the living units at Our Place.

 

Look, Mike K. and I have a very close friend that works full time for Cool Aid, and this friend has worked there many years.  And has worked at all their different housing units about town.  And this friend tells us how very comfortable living at some of their places are.  And that the "clients" that live there have zero motivation to move.  That's not what any housing should be, and certainly not my units.

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 20 November 2017 - 08:59 AM.