11779 replies to this topic

[spanky123]

Good on CT-J for an intelligent take on the situation.

 

CT-J is smart enough to realize that the real motivation behind the mural is to increase racism and hate. These fringe groups get their power when they create wedge issues and force people to take sides.

[Nparker]

...city council are stupid for allowing this - on our dime.

I think this is sufficient.

[JimV]

It just disgusts me that they:

 

a) not only approved this repellant piece of graffiti, but actually paid for it with our money; and

b) have wasted hours or days “negotiating” with the “artists” over the details of the hideous POS.

 

And where was CTJ when it was originally approved?  Did she support it?  Sounds to me like another one of her all too common backtracks.  Hint to CTJ:  Try to think about something for 5 minutes before signing on the dotted line.

[Rob Randall]

In her defense, this was pretty routine stuff--they approve temporary murals all the time, you've seen them around the town for decades. I've never heard of an atom of controversy about any of them before now. This is unprecedented. It was supposed to be a zero risk pressure valve and instead it's a problem.

[spanky123]

From what I understand, the mural was part of the 'Everyday Grants Program' that Helps announced over the summer. It provides up to $125K in total to the Mayor's buddies groups that apply. The program is run by Nichola Reddington at the CoV. Her work phone number is 250.361.0363 if you want to tell her what you think about the program.

 

The mural application was provided by the African Heritage Association. According to the CoV's own rules, it should not have been eligible for funding as a protest or demonstration. Nevertheless they were awarded a grant and I understand had a group of artists paint the mural. https://www.victoria... Guidelines.pdf

 

I believe that the entire process was handled by staff and that council never saw the application so you can't blame CTJ. She was the one who correctly saw that trying to incite hate and racism was foolish and has been trying to get the mural changed. 

[Nparker]

... It was supposed to be a zero risk pressure valve and instead it's a problem.

What the mural needs now is a zero risk pressure wash.

[Midnightly]

i'm sure the artist is Thrilled! they got two political statements for the price of one... and this again will hit another round of media coverage i'm sure just like the previous one did....

 

if this was a statue of an old white man it would have been instantly removed in the dawn's early light when no one was around (crane booked before even getting the approval for the removal) but because this is some artist trying to make a political statement it had to go through a whole wave of media multiple discussions then sit on it for months, more discussions to the point where it's yesterday's news before something is finally done.... then once it's done lets bring it back for another political statement

[spanky123]

The group I feel sorry for in all of this are the executive of the AHA. This group has been around for at least 20 years and has built an excellent relationship with the police, the various munis and other community groups. In fact years ago I volunteered for them and helped raise money when their leaders were associated with the Black History Awareness Society. 

 

Like all groups that achieve success and mainstream support,. there is always a subset that want to undermine that and return to activism. Any gains made over the decades are not enough and the current leadership sold out to the 'establishment' and must be humiliated and replaced. From what I can tell, none of the 'artists' are part of the AHA leadership and I doubt many have any involvement at all with the group. Nevertheless they have taken over the message and forced the AHA to backpaddle. 

Edited by spanky123, 30 October 2020 - 07:03 AM.

[JimV]

 

 

I believe that the entire process was handled by staff and that council never saw the application so you can't blame CTJ. She was the one who correctly saw that trying to incite hate and racism was foolish and has been trying to get the mural changed. 

So staff get to hand out taxpayer money without the elected officials even knowing anything about it?

 

If so, council is even stupider, more irresponsible and incompetent than I thought.  And that’s setting the bar pretty low.

[spanky123]

So staff get to hand out taxpayer money without the elected officials even knowing anything about it?

 

If so, council is even stupider, more irresponsible and incompetent than I thought.  And that’s setting the bar pretty low.

 

Council approved the program spending and policy. Just saying that I don't think they reviewed individual applications. 

Edited by spanky123, 30 October 2020 - 11:01 AM.

[On the Level]

Is the City Manager out to destroy VicPD?  Any back story?

[JohnsonStBridge]

So staff get to hand out taxpayer money without the elected officials even knowing anything about it?

 

If so, council is even stupider, more irresponsible and incompetent than I thought.  And that’s setting the bar pretty low.

 

The City of Victoria capital and operating budget is ~$350 million. Council should not be individually reviewing and approving every grant or expenditure. Their job is to review and approve the budget to ensure it aligns with City priorities. Also to ensure staff have the proper framework and policies to make spending within and how to handle an approval process on variances or exceptions to this guidance. It's a proper delegation of authority.

 

I'd even suggest that council would be better served focusing on more impactful uses of their time (or reducing their time) than increasing the amount of time they spend by reviewing and potentially politicizing every spend out of City hall.

[On the Level]

Council should not be individually reviewing and approving every grant or expenditure. 

 

Agreed....but can't "staff" be held accountable?  How do we even know if staff were directed to make this decision?  It certainly aligns with Together Victoria dogma.

[Nparker]

Staff probably don't have much choice but to approve projects that align with Council's dogma.

[JohnsonStBridge]

Of course staff can be held accountable but if it met the business/financial plan of funding these projects and fit within the approved budget, I'm not sure what they are to be held to account for when the lettering was not included in the draft that was approved. If I recall, public art funding was expanded in a recent budget along with the artist in residence program. I think it is safe to assume the decision was within the annual plan council approved.

 

It wouldn't surprise me if council had some kind of influence over the selection process through a panel or committee similar to how they were making decisions via the 'City Family'. In fact, I'd support city staff having more control over who gets their project funded and less meddling from council.

[JimV]

Council should not be individually reviewing and approving every grant or expenditure. 

It behooves them to at least review proposed grants and ask questions.  A great big BLM mural should have raised an immediate flag.  As is, they have wasted far more time already on this than would have been required for a review.

 

Most of the city money is spent on infrastructure, emergency services and parks.  These costs are not considered line by line, only proposed increases or program changes.  It’s not like they spend every working hour pouring over the fire department budget.  They have time to quickly review grant proposals, or should have.  Whether the city should be giving money for ‘artworks’ at all, particularly when we are on the verge of economic catastrophe is another relevant question.

[Nparker]

...Whether the city should be giving money for ‘artworks’ at all, particularly when we are on the verge of economic catastrophe is another relevant question.

The CoV council would authorize new strings for Nero's fiddle if it fit their agenda.

[Victoria Watcher]

Victoria Police Chief Del Manak says recent changes to a controversial mural in Bastion Square are “as offensive, if not more so” than the original anti-police message they replaced.

In a statement released late Friday afternoon, Manak said he was “deeply disappointed” with the outcome of negotiations between the city and the artists.

In my opinion, the divisive message contained in this artwork is inaccurate, misinformed and disrespectful,” he said.

“It is an affront to the women and men of the Victoria Police Department, who serve our ­communities with integrity, compassion and honour.”



https://www.timescol...ural-1.24230979

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 31 October 2020 - 05:07 AM.

[Awaiting Juno]

It boggles the mind how our council can take something awful (ACAB in a municipally funded mural) and make it worse, and yet time and time again, they rise to the challenge.

 

I hope Stephen Andrew get elected - it'll be a long 2 years and will likely feel like pushing on a string for all of it.  

[Victoria Watcher]

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 31 October 2020 - 07:14 AM.