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Missing Middle Housing Initiative (MMHI) in the City of Victoria


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#2181 GaryOak

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 09:23 AM

The value of the house and property rose faster than the rest of the municipality so they had to pay more than previously. The value of the property more than doubled in the course of a few years. This was back in the early 2000s when that wasn't a common occurrence. They had 3 children, a mortgage, and plenty of other fixed costs. They sold the house and bought another place in North Saanich.

#2182 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 09:26 AM

The value of the property doubled.

That made the exit a little easier, I’m sure.
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#2183 dasmo

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 09:27 AM

That’s a problem with tax law though. Perhaps frame it as an injustice the government is creating. One solution would be to peg your property tax to inflation until the property is sold…. Or not have it at all…
I don’t get my road paved nor do I use the school system. I also don’t take the child tax benefit. I only pay my taxes so they don’t kill me.

Edited by dasmo, 14 March 2023 - 09:28 AM.

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#2184 Mike K.

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 09:31 AM

The value of the house and property rose faster than the rest of the municipality so they had to pay more than previously. The value of the property more than doubled in the course of a few years. This was back in the early 2000s when that wasn't a common occurrence. They had 3 children, a mortgage, and plenty of other fixed costs. They sold the house and bought another place in North Saanich.



Ok, that helps clarify the situation a little better.

So it’s not so much a displacement scenario, as an economic opportunity scenario related to the cost of a property that required a lot of investment to bring it up to a higher standard. Displacement is when you’re forced to move away, not when land values double, you sell your holding, and move nearby in the same community. Nobody was economically harmed here, in other words.
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#2185 Ismo07

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 09:42 AM

That’s a problem with tax law though. Perhaps frame it as an injustice the government is creating. One solution would be to peg your property tax to inflation until the property is sold…. Or not have it at all…
I don’t get my road paved nor do I use the school system. I also don’t take the child tax benefit. I only pay my taxes so they don’t kill me.

 

Grant covers school taxes anyway doesn't it?  Only folks with multiple properties and commercial pay for the schools...



#2186 GaryOak

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 09:46 AM

If they could have they definitely would have stayed in that property and not have sold it. You can both be a beneficiary of generational wealth and a victim of gentrification by being forced out of the place you're family had called home for almost a century.

#2187 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 09:48 AM

They could have taken a loan against it to pay the taxes.  Or sold it and rented it back on a long lease.   Lots of options when you have so much equity.


Edited by Victoria Watcher, 14 March 2023 - 09:55 AM.


#2188 Mike K.

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 09:52 AM

If they could have they definitely would have stayed in that property and not have sold it. You can both be a beneficiary of generational wealth and a victim of gentrification by being forced out of the place you're family had called home for almost a century.

I think that’s called a First World problem.

Gentrification forces you out of your community. Your parents sold a rapidly appreciating asset, and moved within the same community.

The concerns about 15 minute cities is they push out individuals, while wealthier individuals take their place. Those that are displaced, and then pushed far afield to afford the housing they once could afford in the city centre.

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#2189 dasmo

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:13 AM

The conspiracy theories are much worse than that

#2190 GaryOak

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:15 AM

It's not a factor of 15 minute cities that's just how the world works. Unless you go the plutonic Soviet route of have everyone no matter what class or societal standing live in the same government owned building/neighborhood.

#2191 Nparker

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:17 AM

...Unless you go the plutonic Soviet route of have everyone no matter what class or societal standing live in the same government owned building/neighborhood.

Give the NDP another 2 terms in office and that's what we'll have in BC.


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#2192 GaryOak

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:17 AM

That's why you hear the semi joke about shooting off a few rounds into the air to keep the rents low.

#2193 Mike K.

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:17 AM

It's not a factor of 15 minute cities that's just how the world works. Unless you go the plutonic Soviet route of have everyone no matter what class or societal standing live in the same government owned building/neighborhood.

 

Oh oh.

 

I don't think Housing Twitter wants people admitting that pushing out lower income people, is just a cost of doing business.


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#2194 GaryOak

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:30 AM

Those who say say that new housing without government subsidies will be affordable are either naive or lying. But the new housing that's built today will become the adorable housing of 30-50 years down the line, as long as we keep building housing to meet the demand of the market.

#2195 Ismo07

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:36 AM

Those who say say that new housing without government subsidies will be affordable are either naive or lying. But the new housing that's built today will become the adorable housing of 30-50 years down the line, as long as we keep building housing to meet the demand of the market.

 

I'm not so sure, todays 50 year old house is hardly affordable.



#2196 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:37 AM

Those who say say that new housing without government subsidies will be affordable are either naive or lying. 

 

It could be if we wanted it to be.  But current homeowners do not want to see their values drop.   And we can't have cheaper housing without everyone's values going down.

 

screenshot-www.realtor.ca-2023.03.14-14_36_39.png

 

1349.98 sqft

$520,000

 

https://www.realtor....lgary-royal-oak


Edited by Victoria Watcher, 14 March 2023 - 10:39 AM.

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#2197 dasmo

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:42 AM

Or we tap the brakes on immigration for a bit. Sorry for the hate speech but supply and demand is only an equation.

Or the Feds stop trying to suppress wage inflation and kill small businesses with their crazy money games. Then we could catch up to the market as has been the only way it’s happened historically.

Or they stop with the insane net zero requirements and allow for “Active Homes” that are less expensive to build but have way less embodied energy to build them. Like those inexpensive 40s war shacks with the fantastic floors we all love here.

Etc. etc.

Nothing the government actually does is for our benefit thus the conspiracy mindset that is ever growing.

It’s just two weeks to flatten the curve….
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#2198 GaryOak

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:43 AM

I'm not so sure, todays 50 year old house is hardly affordable.


Because we haven't been building enough to meet market demand.

#2199 Sparky

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 10:43 AM

^^ Ha! 1349.98 square feet… call it 1,350.
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#2200 dasmo

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Posted 14 March 2023 - 11:00 AM

Because we haven't been building enough to meet market demand.

We aren’t building them to 70’s standards either. See post above.
Affordable building is nearly impossible now. Even if the land was free.
Ask for a raise. That’s how I bought my first home. I couldn’t afford one. Thought I never would. Asked for a 100% raise. I didn’t get it year one. That made me save so I could say f*ck you. Then they gave me 15% a year after a management change.
Our only way to affordable housing is by raising our wages ourselves. No solution will come from government. The only thing they are really good at is taking our money and killing us.

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