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City of Victoria | 2018-2022 | Mayor and council general discussion


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#9081 Stephen Andrew

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Posted 22 May 2021 - 04:39 PM

Da homeless shelter. Worry not for the White Spot owners, BC Housing will pay 5x what the property is worth (assuming of course one of their buddies hasn't already bought it).


From what I heard developers are looking to purchase.

Whether that is still in play may depend on recent purchases

#9082 Rex Waverly

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Posted 22 May 2021 - 06:52 PM

Lotbiniere is a very steep, no through lane. The pavement was in good shape. No cars can go up it for more than a few metres as there are bollards. More waste of money to repave. . The road across from it, Durban, will be getting a lot more traffic with the blockade. Then we will be zigzagging all over I suppose. 

 

Traffic shouldn't increase significantly on Durban.... it's not like people are going to continue to take Richardson and just go around the blockade and back; the other traffic calming measures (mostly a bunch of speed bumps as well as significantly narrowing the travel lanes by allowing on-street parking on both sides) would make that route much slower and more inconvenient....  Traffic will naturally take the fastest / easiest route, and it won't be Richardson anymore. 



#9083 Awaiting Juno

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Posted 23 May 2021 - 07:32 AM

Traffic shouldn't increase significantly on Durban.... it's not like people are going to continue to take Richardson and just go around the blockade and back; the other traffic calming measures (mostly a bunch of speed bumps as well as significantly narrowing the travel lanes by allowing on-street parking on both sides) would make that route much slower and more inconvenient....  Traffic will naturally take the fastest / easiest route, and it won't be Richardson anymore. 

 

Here's part of my problem - the real barrier to more people riding bikes at this point in time isn't the bike infrastructure on roads, it's what people do with their bikes when they get to their destination and the security of the bike while they're busy doing those other things. I currently ride my bike for recreation only and do not leave it unattended. Why? I have little confidence, even with a good bike lock that my bike will be there when I return. If we want more people to bike in this city, we need to do something about rampant bike theft in this city.


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#9084 A Girl is No one

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Posted 23 May 2021 - 07:37 AM

Here's part of my problem - the real barrier to more people riding bikes at this point in time isn't the bike infrastructure on roads, it's what people do with their bikes when they get to their destination and the security of the bike while they're busy doing those other things. I currently ride my bike for recreation only and do not leave it unattended. Why? I have little confidence, even with a good bike lock that my bike will be there when I return. If we want more people to bike in this city, we need to do something about rampant bike theft in this city.

Exactly! I’d love to do my errands by bike (when it carrying heavy items back) but won’t because I can’t risk losing my bike to theft. Until that crime is taken seriously (as opposed to now where multiple police officers will stand by a chop shop and try to be “friends” with the criminals instead of enforcing the law) I will have to continue to drive - and out of downtown so I can find parking.

Edited by A Girl is No one, 23 May 2021 - 07:38 AM.

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#9085 mbjj

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Posted 23 May 2021 - 07:44 AM

Traffic shouldn't increase significantly on Durban.... it's not like people are going to continue to take Richardson and just go around the blockade and back; the other traffic calming measures (mostly a bunch of speed bumps as well as significantly narrowing the travel lanes by allowing on-street parking on both sides) would make that route much slower and more inconvenient....  Traffic will naturally take the fastest / easiest route, and it won't be Richardson anymore. 

 

Traffic shouldn't increase significantly on Durban.... it's not like people are going to continue to take Richardson and just go around the blockade and back; the other traffic calming measures (mostly a bunch of speed bumps as well as significantly narrowing the travel lanes by allowing on-street parking on both sides) would make that route much slower and more inconvenient....  Traffic will naturally take the fastest / easiest route, and it won't be Richardson anymore. 

I will because that's the route I'm going! Fairfield isn't going where I want to go and if it's anything like what Cook St. has become, it certainly won't be faster. 


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#9086 JimV

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Posted 25 May 2021 - 02:07 PM

I used the roundabout again this morning.  It’s clear that no one knows how it’s supposed to work (or they do but won’t risk it.)  There were two cars ahead of me on Southgate.  The first driver remained stopped even though the southbound traffic on Cook was turning into Southgate and there was no northbound traffic. Eventually he scooted around the circle to head north, followed quickly by the next guy then me.  Nobody wanted to be in that cramped little circle when through traffic was coming.  I might add that all Cook traffic was slow because of all the construction on the street.  This thing is an accident waiting to happen.



#9087 Hotel Mike

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Posted 25 May 2021 - 02:25 PM

And if you're coming south on Cook, and you plan to turn west on Southgate, you no longer have the right turning lane the whole way. You have to scooch over to meld into one lane for about one block, before you can turn right. Really stupid. 


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Don't be so sure.:cool:

#9088 JohnsonStBridge

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Posted 25 May 2021 - 03:03 PM

I've found the roundabout has made turning off of Southgate easier.


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#9089 mbjj

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Posted 25 May 2021 - 03:12 PM

I noticed that stretch of Cook where there used to be the two lanes before Southgate, now has parking next to the curb (or will have when the sewer work is finished). That seemed so odd to me I had to do a double take. 



#9090 Rex Waverly

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Posted 25 May 2021 - 03:38 PM

And if you're coming south on Cook, and you plan to turn west on Southgate, you no longer have the right turning lane the whole way. You have to scooch over to meld into one lane for about one block, before you can turn right. Really stupid. 

 

The previous southbound right turn lane was really unusual and non-standard, with the lane line curving around the road.... likely was encouraging vehicle to travel at higher speeds around the corner than is typical, which, judging by the custom 'yield for peds' sign, was likely an issue for peds crossing Southgate.

 

Also, having southbound through and right turn traffic in the same lane provides additional gaps for traffic on Southgate to turn out onto Cook St, which should improve the eastbound left / right turn movements.

 

Also narrowing of the roadway reduces driver speeds, which is a bonus since it's a 30km/h zone.


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#9091 Mike K.

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Posted 25 May 2021 - 04:55 PM

It was hardly ideal, for sure. I don’t mind the traffic circle, but it takes one run to get a feel for it.

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#9092 JimV

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Posted 27 May 2021 - 07:02 AM

The previous southbound right turn lane was really unusual and non-standard, with the lane line curving around the road.... likely was encouraging vehicle to travel at higher speeds around the corner than is typical, which, judging by the custom 'yield for peds' sign, was likely an issue for peds crossing Southgate.

 

Also, having southbound through and right turn traffic in the same lane provides additional gaps for traffic on Southgate to turn out onto Cook St, which should improve the eastbound left / right turn movements.

 

Also narrowing of the roadway reduces driver speeds, which is a bonus since it's a 30km/h zone.

I’ve used that intersection literally thousands of times.  I never noticed a problem with the west turn onto Southgate, either for cars or pedestrians.

 

Having turning and through traffic in the same lane just adds to the confusion.  You don’t know what the car behind the turner is going to do so you have to make a quick decision whether to pull into the roundabout or not.  You then have a similar choice re the northbound traffic.  They might yield or they might not.  Do you want to bet your life on defending your right of way?

 

Fans of forced speed reduction must love James Bay now.  The multitude of traffic obstructions makes getting anywhere quickly (or just getting anywhere) very difficult.

 

The roundabout was a poor choice for that location.  Unnecessary in the first place and too cramped to realize any benefits most of the time.  I think the whole street work situation has become an analogue for city council.  Those who support Lisa and the TV crowd claim to like it, no matter what.  For the rest of us it’s just another reason to dislike them.


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#9093 Rex Waverly

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Posted 27 May 2021 - 08:42 AM

I’ve used that intersection literally thousands of times.  I never noticed a problem with the west turn onto Southgate, either for cars or pedestrians.

 

Thousands of cars go through there a day; Even if a near-miss occurred there once a week, the odds of any individual driver noticing are pretty low. And i'm not saying there ever was an issue, just that the previous layout was less safe than a standard intersection, with the bizarre lane line markings and the set-back sidewalk. They don't typically put custom warning signs telling drivers to watch for pedestrians at every intersection, so the fact that one was placed there is pretty strong (albeit circumstantial) evidence that there is / was an issue there.

 

 

Having turning and through traffic in the same lane just adds to the confusion.  You don’t know what the car behind the turner is going to do so you have to make a quick decision whether to pull into the roundabout or not.  You then have a similar choice re the northbound traffic.  They might yield or they might not.  Do you want to bet your life on defending your right of way?

 

Aside from the fact that the car behind the turner should also be signaling if they are turning, the car in front is slowing down to make the turn; this provides the gap. This only works if the car behind the turner can't go around, because they are in the same lane. Previously, no gap would have been there.

 

There shouldn't have to be a decision re: northbound traffic for a vehicle turning left off Southgate. Northbound traffic should always yield to traffic in the roundabout. There is no excuse for a driver not to yield; there is multiple signs ahead warning the driver.... roundabouts are not new anymore and are pretty common, if someone doesn't know how they work by now, why are they still driving? For traffic operations to work, drivers have to assume others will drive somewhat according to the rules, stopping at yield / stop / red lights and so on. 

 

The good news is, it's not 'betting your life', it's at most betting your car's paint job.... the speeds are very low (30km/h or less) and any impact is at an angle, not head-on / T-bone so any damage is much less. That's one of the key safety features of a roundabout, far fewer severe collisions. 



#9094 Hotel Mike

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Posted 27 May 2021 - 10:06 AM

As I find myself driving in this city, my regular outburst is "what now?" There is construction just about everywhere, and some of it is for designs to make driving more frustrating. I too have used the Southgate/Cook intersection many, many times. I have never seen any problems. Personally, I was always very aware of any pedestrians when I made my turn. 


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Don't be so sure.:cool:

#9095 Love the rock

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Posted 27 May 2021 - 10:35 AM

Thousands of cars go through there a day; Even if a near-miss occurred there once a week, the odds of any individual driver noticing are pretty low. And i'm not saying there ever was an issue, just that the previous layout was less safe than a standard intersection, with the bizarre lane line markings and the set-back sidewalk. They don't typically put custom warning signs telling drivers to watch for pedestrians at every intersection, so the fact that one was placed there is pretty strong (albeit circumstantial) evidence that there is / was an issue there.

 

 

 

Aside from the fact that the car behind the turner should also be signaling if they are turning, the car in front is slowing down to make the turn; this provides the gap. This only works if the car behind the turner can't go around, because they are in the same lane. Previously, no gap would have been there.

 

There shouldn't have to be a decision re: northbound traffic for a vehicle turning left off Southgate. Northbound traffic should always yield to traffic in the roundabout. There is no excuse for a driver not to yield; there is multiple signs ahead warning the driver.... roundabouts are not new anymore and are pretty common, if someone doesn't know how they work by now, why are they still driving? For traffic operations to work, drivers have to assume others will drive somewhat according to the rules, stopping at yield / stop / red lights and so on. 

 

 

I want to ask you Rex how many cars actually use or know to use a turn signal when exiting a roundabout.


Edited by Love the rock, 27 May 2021 - 10:37 AM.


#9096 E2V

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Posted 27 May 2021 - 11:07 AM

Mostly ex Edmontonians


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#9097 Rex Waverly

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Posted 27 May 2021 - 11:09 AM

I want to ask you Rex how many cars actually use or know to use a turn signal when exiting a roundabout.

 

I would hope it would be all of them, but that's probably a bit optimistic.  But at least for right turns, I imagine at least the people that signaled before the roundabout was installed will still do so; i can't see any reason they would change behavior for what is essentially the same movement.  



#9098 sebberry

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Posted 27 May 2021 - 12:30 PM

Here's part of my problem - the real barrier to more people riding bikes at this point in time isn't the bike infrastructure on roads, it's what people do with their bikes when they get to their destination and the security of the bike while they're busy doing those other things. I currently ride my bike for recreation only and do not leave it unattended. Why? I have little confidence, even with a good bike lock that my bike will be there when I return. If we want more people to bike in this city, we need to do something about rampant bike theft in this city.

 

I love the folks on social media saying you should just rely on insurance and essentially shrug it off if it gets stolen.  These are the same folks who usually protest anything to do with personal property ownership, like cars or single family houses because it runs counter to the socialist agenda.  


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#9099 rmpeers

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Posted 27 May 2021 - 02:47 PM

Sounds as if a majority of whichever council members bothered to show up voted against the proposed BHP roads reopening.

And no way in hell am I ever voting for Young again. Together Victoria could run council candidates who campaign dressed in straitjackets, promise that all homeowners will be put in forced labor camps, hire drug dealers as City employees, and vow to rename every street in the city. Young still won't get my vote.
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#9100 On the Level

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Posted 27 May 2021 - 03:23 PM

Sounds as if a majority of whichever council members bothered to show up voted against the proposed BHP roads reopening.

And no way in hell am I ever voting for Young again. Together Victoria could run council candidates who campaign dressed in straitjackets, promise that all homeowners will be put in forced labor camps, hire drug dealers as City employees, and vow to rename every street in the city. Young still won't get my vote.

 

Young was the deciding vote against.  He is drinkin the coolaid....and now maintaining the same nonsense.  He pulled the same stunt with Picnic Point.


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