26251 replies to this topic

[sebberry]

Got more? Which email? I went to that link, and just searched for 'Lab'. no hits.

 

Doesn't appear to be searchable.  Try searching for a word clearly visible on one of the pages.  No results.  Guess they haven't heard of OCR

[Victoria Watcher]

What emails? I can't find them in that dump.

 

 

What is slowly becoming clear is that a host of top scientists chose to dismiss the lab leak theory for political and funding reasons, rather than scientific ones.

 

https://www.moneycon...ee-7943821.html

[m3m]

I'm certain when the dust settles, legal cases and settlements will run for many years. I also have a feeling that anyone bullied or coerced into taking this vaccine will get substantial compensation.

https://peckford42.w...s-and-freedoms/



TFord

So I get the protection the vaccine offers and I get additional financial compensation? Sweet!!

[dasmo]

Can we all just agree that the anti-mask, anti-vax conspiracy folks are the ones that the virus has the biggest chance of mutating in and being spread by?  

 

It's quite ironic that whose who cry the loudest about their rights being trampled on are the ones who are largely responsible for the continuation of the need to suspend some of our charter rights to keep the damn virus under control.  

Sounds like science to me. "How about we agree to hate a group of people who we decide are unclean". 

I work from home, order groceries online. Haven't been to eat in a restaurant for two years. You? 

[todd]

Sounds like science to me. "How about we agree to hate a group of people who we decide are unclean". 
I work from home, order groceries online. Haven't been to eat in a restaurant for two years. You?

Is it possible the vaccine doesn’t work and just that the anti-VAX crowd are so dirty and love to huff other peoples breath so much that they are that many times more likely to get coronavirus?

[Mike K.]

What part of what I said is conspiracy? It is happening right now. 

 

The part hinging on ulterior, nefarious, and cabalistic motives behind the events taking place.

 

Asking people not to use masks, then asking them to use masks, is not a conspiracy, it's just a lame chain of events in a country that found itself unprepared to deal with a pandemic. There is no evil plot veiled behind the missteps we saw over the last 18 months. Please don't give incompetence and hot potatoe-ing so much respect 

 

Remember, this all started with the virus being the issue, then the vaccine became the issue. It's always something.

[amor de cosmos]

The part hinging on ulterior, nefarious, and cabalistic motives behind the events taking place.

kabbalah is just jewish mysticism, it might be obscure even to a lot of jews but i wouldn't say there's anything dark/nefarious/sinister/etc about it. i don't think they'd appreciate the association with conspiracy theories or political corruption.

Edited by amor de cosmos, 17 January 2022 - 02:28 PM.

[max.bravo]

The part hinging on ulterior, nefarious, and cabalistic motives behind the events taking place.

 

Asking people not to use masks, then asking them to use masks, is not a conspiracy, it's just a lame chain of events in a country that found itself unprepared to deal with a pandemic. There is no evil plot veiled behind the missteps we saw over the last 18 months. Please don't give incompetence and hot potatoe-ing so much respect 

 

Remember, this all started with the virus being the issue, then the vaccine became the issue. It's always something.

Mike, I recall you making the point (several times over the years) that throughout history those perpetrating the evil deeds usually believe they're doing the right thing.

 

Dictatorial leaders in history believed they were doing right; so did most of their minions who carried out their orders. None of which actions were considered to have nefarious or cabalistic motives by those who were on their side of the wars- rather, they were considered virtuous, or at worst- merely incompetent.

 

So don't confuse the motive with the reality here-- because there is a real, measurable, unconstitutional loss of freedom occurring in our country, in front of our eyes. You're ok with that?

 

Yes, some (mostly ignorant) people think this is motivated by a satan-worshipping cabal. But the reality is actually much more frightening, isn't it? That it's being perpetrated by people who think they're doing the right thing, and perpetuated by people (like you) who think it's okay because you agree with the motivation behind the freedom-restricting orders.

 

Step back and take the 30,000 ft view here... there is an unprecedented and unwarranted loss of freedom and othering/division occurring for those who don't consent to taking an experimental gene therapy - which frankly cannot and will not end the pandemic, because it doesn't stop spread, or provide sterilizing immunity. It's not right, even if the intentions behind it are virtuous and not nefarious. Isn't that obvious?

Edited by max.bravo, 17 January 2022 - 02:37 PM.

[sebberry]

experimental gene therapy

 

This is the type of misleading and inflammatory language that does more harm than good to your argument.

 

What happened to all the smart-meter opponents?

[amor de cosmos]

wow cabal (a secret clique) actually does come from the hebrew kabbalah, which is esoteric jewish mysticism but certainly not evil, sinister, etc like the necronomicon or whatever. well that sure isn't nice for the jews.

Edited by amor de cosmos, 17 January 2022 - 03:08 PM.

[Victoria Watcher]

CityNews Vancouver:

 

 

B.C. extends COVID restrictions indefinitely

 

 

B.C. businesses, including restaurants, bars, gyms, event venues, and places of worship will have to put up with COVID-19 restrictions a while longer, after the province announced it is extending current rules. In her order issued Monday, B.C. Provincial Health Officer Dr. Bonnie Henry said due to the ongoing threat posed by COVID-19 and the burden currently faced by the health-care system, she is extending restrictions which were set to expire at midnight. The order does not have an expiration date, meaning the restrictions will remain in place until announced otherwise.

 

 

 

 

 

^ that is the kind of thing that the opposition parties should - well - oppose.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 17 January 2022 - 03:22 PM.

[Victoria Watcher]

Alberta:

 

 

 

There are 1,007 people in hospital with COVID-19, including 94 in intensive care. This is an increase of 185 hospitalizations since Friday’s count of 822.

[dasmo]

CityNews Vancouver:

 

 

B.C. extends COVID restrictions indefinitely

 

 

B.C. businesses, including restaurants, bars, gyms, event venues, and places of worship will have to put up with COVID-19 restrictions a while longer, after the province announced it is extending current rules. In her order issued Monday, B.C. Provincial Health Officer Dr. Bonnie Henry said due to the ongoing threat posed by COVID-19 and the burden currently faced by the health-care system, she is extending restrictions which were set to expire at midnight. The order does not have an expiration date, meaning the restrictions will remain in place until announced otherwise.

 

 

 

 

 

^ that is the kind of thing that the opposition parties should - well - oppose.

No demonstration, no democracy, no free society. What gives them the right? Shoot the charter has section 33 that was meant for situations like this. They didn't invoke it. This is the one law that governs our governments and they think they are above it. These are "orders" that are not debated, have no checks or balances and it is up to us plebes to push back since few politicians seem willing. 

 

I don't know how anyone can see this passing Oakes test....

"The Oakes test was created by the Supreme Court of Canada in the 1986 case of R v Oakes.[1]  The test interprets section 1 of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, which states that rights are guaranteed, “subject only to such reasonable limits . . . as can be demonstrably justified in a free and democratic society.”[2] This means that the government must establish that the benefits of a law outweigh its negative impact—that is, its violation of a Charter right."

https://www.constitu.../07/oakes-test/

Edited by dasmo, 17 January 2022 - 03:44 PM.

[Moderation]

 

 

Step back and take the 30,000 ft view here... there is an unprecedented and unwarranted loss of freedom and othering/division occurring for those who don't consent to taking an experimental gene therapy - which frankly cannot and will not end the pandemic, because it doesn't stop spread, or provide sterilizing immunity. It's not right, even if the intentions behind it are virtuous and not nefarious. Isn't that obvious?

From my 30 000 ft view of the above. there is an unprecedented loss of freedom.  There is othering/division between the vaccinate and unvaccinated. I see that.

That the loss of freedom is unwarranted and cannot and will not end the pandemic because it does not stop the spread etc is not right. That is a matter of opinion with which I do not agree. This can be argued endlessly from both points of view. It hard to make much progress if the basic facts are not first agreed upon.

 

Let me start: What is your position on these points.

Does frequent hand washing help reduce the chance of getting or spreading covid?

Does keeping at least 2 meters apart reduce the chance of catching covid?

Do masks help reduce the spread of covid?

Do vaccines reduce the chances of getting very ill with covid and reduce hospitalization and deaths

[Mike K.]

kabbalah is just jewish mysticism, it might be obscure even to a lot of jews but i wouldn't say there's anything dark/nefarious/sinister/etc about it. i don't think they'd appreciate the association with conspiracy theories or political corruption.

 

That's why I said cabalistic, not Kabbalistic.

 

A cabal is a secret group. It has no relation to Jews or Judaism in modern parlance, no more than someone named Chris has a relation to Orthodox Catholicism.

[dasmo]

From my 30 000 ft view of the above. there is an unprecedented loss of freedom.  There is othering/division between the vaccinate and unvaccinated. I see that.

That the loss of freedom is unwarranted and cannot and will not end the pandemic because it does not stop the spread etc is not right. That is a matter of opinion with which I do not agree. This can be argued endlessly from both points of view. It hard to make much progress if the basic facts are not first agreed upon.

 

Let me start: What is your position on these points.

Does frequent hand washing help reduce the chance of getting or spreading covid?

Does keeping at least 2 meters apart reduce the chance of catching covid?

Do masks help reduce the spread of covid?

Do vaccines reduce the chances of getting very ill with covid and reduce hospitalization and deaths

Thing is no one knows the answers to the above. They are all assumptions. People killing themselves, overdosing, losing their livelihoods is not. Plus, we have been doing all of the above and here we still are. What is that quote about doing the same thing expecting different results again? 

[sebberry]

What do you want us all to do, Dasmo?

[Victoria Watcher]

Vancouver Sun:

 

 

 

 

 

B.C.’S COVID-19 CASE NUMBERS

 

As of the latest figures given on Jan. 17:

 

• Total number of confirmed cases: 299,146 (35,985 active)
• New cases: 5,625 (2,383/1,733/1,509)
• Total deaths: 2,490 (33 new deaths)
• Hospitalized cases: 819
• Intensive care: 99
• Total vaccinations: 4,447,145 received first dose (89.2% of eligible pop. 5+); 4,155,929 second doses (83.4%); 1,544,191 third doses (33.3%)
• Recovered from acute infection: 257,677
• Long-term care and assisted-living homes, and acute care facilities currently affected: 50

 

 

 

https://vancouversun...hit-b-c-ferries

 

 

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 17 January 2022 - 04:03 PM.

[Moderation]

 

 

I don't know how anyone can see this passing Oakes test....

"The Oakes test was created by the Supreme Court of Canada in the 1986 case of R v Oakes.[1]  The test interprets section 1 of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, which states that rights are guaranteed, “subject only to such reasonable limits . . . as can be demonstrably justified in a free and democratic society.”[2] This means that the government must establish that the benefits of a law outweigh its negative impact—that is, its violation of a Charter right."

https://www.constitu.../07/oakes-test/

Here is a link to legal information re powers under the Provincial Emergency Act as they may relate to Charter Rights.

 

https://www.mccarthy...mergency-powers

[Mike K.]

Mike, I recall you making the point (several times over the years) that throughout history those perpetrating the evil deeds usually believe they're doing the right thing.

 

Dictatorial leaders in history believed they were doing right; so did most of their minions who carried out their orders. None of which actions were considered to have nefarious or cabalistic motives by those who were on their side of the wars- rather, they were considered virtuous, or at worst- merely incompetent.

 

The difference here, is society as a whole, globally, believes we are doing the right thing. There will always be people who disagree with the will and desires of the proverbial whole, but the alternatives to not doing what we're doing are not very good. At least according to the global scientific community.

 

Back in the Harper era we were told not to muzzle scientists. Well, now they're unmuzzled and guiding society in every nation and political jurisdiction.