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#1661 spanky123

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 01:43 PM

We are talking about spaces lost is 50 not 50 patios, otherwise I would have identified it as such.

 

What I was getting at Ismo is that if we assume each patio takes up 2-3 spaces it seems like there are far more than 15-25 patios in town.



#1662 Ismo07

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 01:53 PM

What I was getting at Ismo is that if we assume each patio takes up 2-3 spaces it seems like there are far more than 15-25 patios in town.

 

It does seem so...  This is what I'm being told... I will do a little more scientific look at it however.  Some patio spaces do not take any spaces so.  I'll get a better read later...


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#1663 Mike K.

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 02:54 PM

Your numbers are incorrect kind sir. Oh you are talking about parking lots again, but have no addition of the people who live downtown who potentially do not require parking anymore when they come downtown. Got it... Most parking lots pre-pandemic were used primarily for long-term parking. Most spaces taken by 9am for the day.

I’m a bit confused by the above.

Anyways, there are hundreds of fewer parking spots in downtown Victoria in 2021 compared to 2019, and the City has also introduced all-day on-street pay parking in select zones downtown. You didn’t have that option in 2019, I don’t think?

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#1664 Ismo07

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 03:07 PM

I’m a bit confused by the above.

Anyways, there are hundreds of fewer parking spots in downtown Victoria in 2021 compared to 2019, and the City has also introduced all-day on-street pay parking in select zones downtown. You didn’t have that option in 2019, I don’t think?

 

Yes there has been all day available parking spaces for 8 years..  Certainly more now...  When an 80 stall parking lot (primarily used by commuters) gets removed and a 100 unit condo goes in, there has to be some assumption that some of those people will work downtown or shop downtown etc.  The reduction for the need for a parking space reduces.  It's not just a loss of 80 parking spots straight up. There are many variables that go into it.  Then when other buildings go up that didn't take a parking spaces it further reduces the requirement for long-term parking.  In addition the loss of that parking lot does little to affect street parking transactions as most aren't used for short-term, at least not much.  I'm sure some stats person can figure out some ratio for each city in particular.  The 100 unit condo also should reduce the reliance of short-term spaces as few will drive for their downtown errands now, they will walk or bike.  How many units did we add downtown since 2019? More than 300? :)


Edited by Ismo07, 11 June 2021 - 03:09 PM.

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#1665 Mike K.

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 03:12 PM

I’m referring to stalls lost since 2019, with nobody living above them yet.

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#1666 Mike K.

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 03:14 PM

Well that’s not technically true. I guess there are people living in the containers on Vancouver at Caledonia.

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#1667 Ismo07

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 03:34 PM

Well that’s not technically true. I guess there are people living in the containers on Vancouver at Caledonia.

 

Which lot did we lose without people living there?  Most have residents by now...  More coming too that weren't parking lots so bonus...  RAP parking lot doesn't count, people haven't parked there since there have been no baseball games or hockey..


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#1668 Mike K.

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 03:39 PM

Store Street, Johnson at Cook and Caledonia. I don’t know the status of City Centre Hotel and its two lots since BC Housing bought the building.

I’m referring to loses since 2019, I’m not referring to losses since all time.

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#1669 LJ

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 07:30 PM

  When an 80 stall parking lot (primarily used by commuters) gets removed and a 100 unit condo goes in, there has to be some assumption that some of those people will work downtown or shop downtown etc.  The reduction for the need for a parking space reduces.

 

I don't think so. If you remove an 80 stall parking lot, used by commuters, you have lost 80 parking spots.

It doesn't matter if nobody in the 100 unit condo has a car, you have still reduced the available parking spots.


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#1670 Greg

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Posted 11 June 2021 - 09:54 PM

Not if some of those 100 new condo owners were formerly commuters...


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#1671 Mike K.

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Posted 12 June 2021 - 07:50 AM

Could be, but the new building they live in has lower ratio of stalls to units, so it’s a wash. We’re seeing everything from zero stalls to 75% typically. It’s ultra rare for 1:1 but Cox Developments does it, and Customs House will have it, and Hudson District has extra.

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#1672 Mike K.

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Posted 12 June 2021 - 07:56 AM

...and we just lost daytime stalls on Government between View and Yates.

I bet, if we added up all parking stall loses since only the summer of 2019 we’d be looking at 500-600 (including the addition of 65 at the Yates on Yates), and another 125-ish are roaring to go on Johnson at Cook (east of Cook). Soon there will be a few more stalls on Fisgard at Blanshard, but that’s temporary.

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#1673 LJ

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Posted 12 June 2021 - 06:50 PM

Not if some of those 100 new condo owners were formerly commuters...

They can't afford to live downtown.


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#1674 Greg

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Posted 12 June 2021 - 07:01 PM

People buying condos downtown are, by definition, people who like being downtown. So I think it is reasonable to imagine that some of them occasionally drove downtown for various reasons before they lived there.



#1675 VIResident

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Posted 14 June 2021 - 04:14 AM

‘This is 100 per cent the worst thing we’ve ever seen’: How Canadian companies are adjusting to supply chain chaos
 
MONTREAL
PUBLISHED 2 HOURS AGO
 
"Companies that will be most successful in weathering this storm are those with the financial capacity to stock inventory and parts in advance, according to Mr. Laflamme. On the flip side, those with tight cash flows and limited access to credit will be particularly vulnerable. The smallest businesses with no experience navigating the whims of spot-market freight costs might not survive."
 
“This is a complete reset of the whole industry,” says Mr. Boisjoli. “Dealers are cleaning out used inventory, new inventory. [Manufacturers] are doing the same. And all of us have a chance to do things better going forward than the system we had before.”
 
"......The paradox is stark: At a time when many companies are generating some of their highest-ever sales, the money isn’t flowing to the bottom line. At Umbra, sales surged 40 per cent last year to roughly $200-million, and they’re up 82 per cent so far this year through May, according to Mr. Mandelbaum. Profit, however, is down 34 per cent as costs eat away at earnings."

Edited by VIResident, 14 June 2021 - 04:17 AM.


#1676 Ismo07

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Posted 14 June 2021 - 07:49 AM

Store Street, Johnson at Cook and Caledonia. I don’t know the status of City Centre Hotel and its two lots since BC Housing bought the building.

I’m referring to loses since 2019, I’m not referring to losses since all time.

 

Store street just started recently and was hardly full, Johnson and Cook?  Not exactly downtown...  City Centre, I'm not clear how many parkers used that lot, actually was kept private and for dining at White Spot I thought...  Right now might be moot as there is plenty of parking at this time.


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#1677 Ismo07

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Posted 14 June 2021 - 07:54 AM

Could be, but the new building they live in has lower ratio of stalls to units, so it’s a wash. We’re seeing everything from zero stalls to 75% typically. It’s ultra rare for 1:1 but Cox Developments does it, and Customs House will have it, and Hudson District has extra.

 

The ratio doesn't matter really unless people buy or rent and they have a car but no space.  The utopic view is that when the person moves into a downtown unit they lose they do not bring a vehicle.  Walk more, bike perhaps or use a car share...  Point is less spots are needed when more people live downtown.

 

...and we just lost daytime stalls on Government between View and Yates.

I bet, if we added up all parking stall loses since only the summer of 2019 we’d be looking at 500-600 (including the addition of 65 at the Yates on Yates), and another 125-ish are roaring to go on Johnson at Cook (east of Cook). Soon there will be a few more stalls on Fisgard at Blanshard, but that’s temporary.

 

You would lose that bet unless you simply follow your definition of loss and do not count what is gained.  We haven't lost daytime parking on that block, I'm actually adding 8 more.. (Don't report that though, just reductions, never repeat additions.)

 

I don't think so. If you remove an 80 stall parking lot, used by commuters, you have lost 80 parking spots.

It doesn't matter if nobody in the 100 unit condo has a car, you have still reduced the available parking spots.

 

I used that 80 loss/ 100 unit as an example.  Usually with an 80 loss there is typically more gained, much more.


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#1678 Mike K.

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Posted 14 June 2021 - 08:03 AM

You don’t like the correlation between rapidly declining parking capacity and use of on-street stalls, I get it.

But what do you think about a correlation between 50% transit ridership compared to 2019 levels, and 86% of on-street parking compared to 2019 levels? You don’t wonder about the causes of a 36 point spread?

We have to look at parking demand in context. There are factors at play in 2021 that make 86% of 2019 numbers not a simple or straightforward side-by-side comparison.

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#1679 Mike K.

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Posted 14 June 2021 - 08:08 AM

You would lose that bet unless you simply follow your definition of loss and do not count what is gained. We haven't lost daytime parking on that block, I'm actually adding 8 more.. (Don't report that though, just reductions, never repeat additions.)


Surely you mean 80?

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#1680 Ismo07

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Posted 14 June 2021 - 08:09 AM

You don’t like the correlation between rapidly declining parking capacity and use of on-street stalls, I get it.

But what do you think about a correlation between 50% transit ridership compared to 2019 levels, and 86% of on-street parking compared to 2019 levels?

We have to look at parking demand in context. There are factors at play that lake 86% of 2019 numbers not a simple or straightforward side-by-side comparison.

 

totally agree not straight forward, there are many factors and I've suggested that all along.  Just suggesting losing a parking lot with x number of spaces that is 90% commuter use might add a negligible effect on-street parking use.  Other factors would weigh more.  Parkade use however is not at that same % of use, it's much lower, which stands to reason also.  Less people are working downtown so less commuters and less on transit use.  Still many restrictions etc.  On-street is mainly short-term parking which is coming back suggesting shoppers, meetings, appointments and general downtown users are returning with less searching for parking spaces, due to less of the same, so finding spaces before going to parkades as a less convenient option.  If anything that is likely keeping numbers a little higher.


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